Well I can see that this blog has had visitors. I welcome comments, questions or stories of your own experiences.
As I wrote before it's disappointing that some links to sites which had stories written by former Yes Youngdo teachers have been redone. With some stories going back to 2002 it's suprising that the sites were updated not long after I started writing this blog. If you look at my early posts you can see notes I added explaining this. Refer to the post titled: "Former Teacher's Stories" which is my third from the bottom.
I have a little feeling that someone working for this hagwon contacted certain people asking that the posts be removed or what have you. Wouldn't be the first time!
December 3, 2008
November 16, 2008
Link and Photo
I'd like to add this link here: http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2008/10/six-english-chains-fined.html This is an article about hagwon chains being fined at another teacher's blog. Yes Youngdo is one of the schools.
I also decided to add this photo which was posted online by a current or former teacher. It shows the reception and sitting area of one of the branches of YY. When I worked for the hagwon we had a room like this but it wasn't nearly as nice.
I also decided to add this photo which was posted online by a current or former teacher. It shows the reception and sitting area of one of the branches of YY. When I worked for the hagwon we had a room like this but it wasn't nearly as nice.
November 5, 2008
Which Teacher Goes First?
I was never part of the management team at Yes Youngdo but I think I know something about this process. The manager talked to me a lot about this and I believe this is what happens each time someone is chosen who will be let go. I'll try to explain as best I can.
Based on what the manager of my branch told me not long before I left there were five-six teachers there that he wanted to leave. And the total number was 16! If the manager wasn't counting me because I was already due to leave, that means he was looking at a group of only 15. Consider the proportion of teachers he wanted to fire: 5-6 out of 15. Five makes 1/3 of them and 6 is 40%. The manager hired a new teacher and started processing their visa just at the time he told me to leave. During the period I had between then and actually going, about ten days, I learned a lot about the situation - hiring, firing and making a decision. The manager said to me later that they decided, I think really he did, that I would be the first to leave. Please read below for more explanation. To put it simply: one new teacher came who would replace one of the existing teachers. The group of 16 teachers was looked at and particularly the group of six or so who weren't doing well according to their standards. Out of those one teacher was chosen who would be let go, and the rest would stay until replacements could be found, until they quit or possibly improved their status to "good teacher."
I believe the process of choosing which teacher to fire went like this. The manager and other staff considered these things:
Based on what the manager of my branch told me not long before I left there were five-six teachers there that he wanted to leave. And the total number was 16! If the manager wasn't counting me because I was already due to leave, that means he was looking at a group of only 15. Consider the proportion of teachers he wanted to fire: 5-6 out of 15. Five makes 1/3 of them and 6 is 40%. The manager hired a new teacher and started processing their visa just at the time he told me to leave. During the period I had between then and actually going, about ten days, I learned a lot about the situation - hiring, firing and making a decision. The manager said to me later that they decided, I think really he did, that I would be the first to leave. Please read below for more explanation. To put it simply: one new teacher came who would replace one of the existing teachers. The group of 16 teachers was looked at and particularly the group of six or so who weren't doing well according to their standards. Out of those one teacher was chosen who would be let go, and the rest would stay until replacements could be found, until they quit or possibly improved their status to "good teacher."
I believe the process of choosing which teacher to fire went like this. The manager and other staff considered these things:
- Some teachers came alone while others came as couples.
- If you fire a single teacher you need find only one replacement, but if you fire a teacher who's part of a couple, the other teacher will most likely quit.
- Finding two replacements at one time is a lot harder than finding one.
- Some teachers also came in pairs such as two girls who are friends.
- Firing one would upset the other, possibly causing her to quit.
- Some teachers had worked several months while many were new having worked only about one month.
- Firing a teacher who's only been there for about a month may seem unfair to the other teachers while firing one who has worked longer makes more sense.
- Firing a teacher who is friends with several other teachers could upset them or hurt the hagwon's reputation if he/she tells them how they were treated.
- A teacher who is well-known or has connections with others such as parents, other hagwons, media, etc. could cause a lot of problems if fired.
I believe after considering so many things, Yes Youngdo chooses the teacher who is not necessarily the worst teacher in the hagwon, but who is the most convenient to fire, the easiest to let go of. A teacher who couldn't cause too many problems such as upsetting other teachers, causing others to quit, talking to students' parents or hurting the hagwon in some other way is the best candidate for dismissal.
- I want to add here that I think it's absolutely wrong for the hagwon to allow six teachers to continue working thinking everything is ok when there is a plan to eventually let them go. Anyone at Yes Youngdo at that time would have said the replacements must be found before teachers are let go but it's still not right in my opinion. Substitutes could be found. Teachers or managers could cover the classes.
Yes Youngdo vs. My Previous Hagwon
The biggest problem I had working day-to-day at my first hagwon in Korea was that the working days were way too long!! We had kindergarten in the morning and early afternoon, elementary school after that and even middle school classes. Last classes finished around 7:30. First ones began around 9:30. That made for a long day!
When I was doing the job search which led to finding employment with Yes Youngdo, the very first thing I looked for in a job was shorter working hours. After that I considered the pay and location. When I found the job at Yes Youngdo I was tired of the job search and wanted to get something ASAP. The fairly short ad on Dave's Esl Cafe which led to my apply stated the working hours were 2-10pm M-F. It may have also said the teaching hours were 4-10. I was satisfied with that. It seemed much better than the hours I had though I would've prefered a little less. When I started working I did feel a difference working shorter days.
However, If I were to make a list of all the pros and cons of the two hagwons, I think I would find that Yes Youngdo fell short in every single area except the working hours.
When I was doing the job search which led to finding employment with Yes Youngdo, the very first thing I looked for in a job was shorter working hours. After that I considered the pay and location. When I found the job at Yes Youngdo I was tired of the job search and wanted to get something ASAP. The fairly short ad on Dave's Esl Cafe which led to my apply stated the working hours were 2-10pm M-F. It may have also said the teaching hours were 4-10. I was satisfied with that. It seemed much better than the hours I had though I would've prefered a little less. When I started working I did feel a difference working shorter days.
However, If I were to make a list of all the pros and cons of the two hagwons, I think I would find that Yes Youngdo fell short in every single area except the working hours.
- Apartment - previous hagwon gave us singles while at Yes Youngdo we shared.
- distance to hagwon - previous hagwon was 2 minute walk from apartment; at Yes Youngdo it was 10 minutes.
- class size - previous hagwon - up to 10, often less; Yes Youngdo - 14, sometimes less
- classroom size - previous hagwon - big enough for teacher to move around room comfortably, space between teacher and students, students sat in tables aranged in U-shape, teacher could easily attend to each student; at Yes Youngdo - this was really bad! 14 desks in 3 rows with absolutely no space between them, teacher had small space at front of room, when standing in front I was looking at the 2nd row, not the first, no way to reach students in 2nd or 3rd row to offer help except for maybe moving desks around.
- curriculum - big difference - previous hagwon we taught many subjects, sometimes did art projects or sang songs, other interesting projects, teacher was free to teach as they wanted as long as they covered the material for each month; at Yes Youngdo every single class was planned! There was so much to do, no time for extra activities. And every class was to be conducted with exactly the same activities in the same order everyday.
- Tests/Quizzes - at my previous hagwon we could give quizzes when we wanted, a test was required once a month. we were free to use the hagwon's test, make our own or combine them. At Yes Youngdo we had to give a quiz in every class, same vocabulary quiz each time. I was never told that I could make my own.
- Homework: at my previous hagwon we were expected to give homework sometimes, however it was up to us how often we gave it. Also we could give any type we wanted. We could even assign artwork as homework or writing a poem. At Yes Youngdo we had to assign homework everyday, and the homework assignments as I remember were all the same! Answering questions in a workbook over the reading done in class was the only type of homework I remember. And the beginning of each class had to be spent going over it!
- American textbooks: Yes Youngdo was proud to have these as part of their curriculum. Only problem was that the students in my class didn't seem to understand. They had to read texts full of short stories designed for US high and middle school students. I remember on the first day reading one sentence from a short story they had read and thinking there's no way they can understand that! At my first hagwon the manager stressed to me once that it was important for the students to understand. I never used such difficult material there as I recall.
- Apartment furnishings - At both hagwons we had tables, beds, chairs. At my former hagwon I had a TV and VCR though it took some time to get them from the school. At Yes Youngdo in my apartment there was only one TV which didn't work very well and it was kept in the room of the person I shared the apartment with. Also at my former hagwon I had a phone while at Yes Youngdo there was none. I had to make some trips to the pay phones because I hadn't yet bought a cell phone. I didn't know what steps foreigners had to take to acquire a cell phone and no one at Yes Youngdo offered any help! Eventually I got one but not after going through some phone cards and borrowing friends' cell phones a few times. I heard some complaints of showers not working well from Yes Youngdo teachers.
- Coming to Korea: at my previous hagwon someone was sent to pick up each teacher from the airport. At Yes Youngdo it wasn't this way.
- Trip to Immigration Office: The owner of my first hagwon took me and another teacher by car one Saturday morning and then to lunch afterwards. At Yes Youngdo the manager gave me the necessary information and told me to take the subway some morning.
- Birthdays/Going-Aways: At my first hagwon every single time a teacher had a birthday or finished their stay the boss arranged for a cake, drinks, or pizza and bought a card which was signed by everyone. Candles were lit. Little fireworks. Whole nine yards. During one of the breaktimes we had a mini party. At Yes Youngdo there was none of it - nothing. Not a word was said by the management about teachers who were leaving. I couldn't help but notice this. Several teachers had birthdays or finished their contracts while I was there.
- Special Activities: Again, my first hagwon won here. Since we were in control of the classes as long as we covered the material there was time for an occasion class trip to McDonald's, a soccer game, singing Christmas carols, coloring a large Christmas tree and other decorations, spending a class playing games in honor of a student's birthday, going away or another special time. There was also an all day festival at Halloween with the teachers in costume and part of the hagwon converted into a haunted house. I'm sure there was more but this is all I can think of at this time. Once I got into teaching at Yes Youngdo, not only was it disappointing to realize that my new hagwon fell short in so many areas, but also looking ahead I guessed that we would never have any of these special activities at Halloween, Christmas or another time. I do remember that there was a little class time for games on some occasions at Yes Youngdo if the material was covered, but there was so much to do in every class there wasn't much time like this.
- Help/Advice/Discipline/Management: This was interesting to say the least. At my first hagwon there were two manager who spoke English perfectly whom we could go to when any questions and problems came up. And they always do when you're a foreign teacher working at a Korean hagwon! Also, when a problem was really serious, we had the option of going to talk to the owner of the school. The manager and owner also took care of discipline problems. Well at Yes Youngdo it was different. When I arrived we had one manager who was a young Korean-American who didn't like his job or living in Korea according to the other teachers. I never heard of teachers going to him to ask about their classes or apartments. I didn't feel that he was really there to help us. He didn't seem to want to help us now that I recall. Later he was replaced by a manager who took his job seriously but mistreated a lot of teachers according to the links I've posted. When we had a discipline problem we were supposed to go to an office girl who was young, not long out of college, and who didn't really like her job either! She wasn't really good with discipline, not as strict as someone in that job needs to be. While I was working there it was announced that she was going to move on to another, probably better job.
- More about the managers: At my first hagwon the two managers had years of hagwon experience, took their jobs seriously, and seemed satisfied with their jobs. At Yes Youngdo the manager and the girl taking care of discipline problems when I arrived were both young, without much experience, and not satisfied with their jobs. The next manager who came was older, more experienced, and worked harder. However thinking back on him, how he treated teachers, his attitude, I don't think he was very happy all around and I don't think he really liked his job. When you are a foreign teacher at a hagwon, these people are very important! If you want to have a good hagwon you must have great people in these positions!
- Photos: At my first hagwon a professional photographer was brought in to take group and individual photos. We all received free copies. At Yes Youngdo, after arriving, the manager told me to one day walk down the street to have a photo taken for 15,000 won which would be reimbursed.
- Teacher's room: My previous hagwon had two spaces in two buildings. When I left all the teachers were working in a building which had a large, very comfortable teacher's room. Each teacher had their own space, chair and cabinet for storage. It was nice looking. At Yes Youngdo we had a smaller room with a table and chairs around it which looked more sterile. There wasn't enough room for all the teachers to sit at the table at one time. During break times some teachers went to this room while others probably stayed in their own rooms or went to a certain place to smoke. Had we had spacious and comfortable classrooms then I don't think the teachers rooom would have matter so much, but we didn't.
- Decor: As I remember the office and all the rooms at Yes Youngdo were painted white, sterile and without decor. At my previous hagwon the walls were painted colors like pink or blue and the teachers covered the walls of their classrooms with students' artwork and posters which the hagwon provided.
- Trips: At my former hagwon we were taken on several day or overnight trips to places like Kangwan-do. While employed at Yes Youngdo there was no trip like this, nor did I hear of one in the past. Later on I did read online that there was one. What's funny is that I asked about this while talking to the manager over the phone when he called to say I'd been accepted. I asked about trips, meaning for the staff and teachers, and he told me that two teachers had travelled to Cheju-do together. I didn't ask more about it.
- Taking teachers out to dinner: (This is one perk that a lot of foreign teachers enjoy. Koreans love to eat out.) Every now and then all the teachers and staff at my previous hagwon were taken out to a restaurant such as VIPs. At YY one time the owner took the teachers out in groups to a restaurant. That my was only chance to really talk to him that I remember. Also one manager and the teachers were instructed to meet someplace for lunch. Some teachers were new then and didn't know how to get to this place. The management didn't explain. I remember explaining it to them myself just a short time before we were supposed to be there. At my previous hagwon we all went together, as I recall driven by the owners or other staff members. We didn't have to pay for the taxi or subway then, but at YY we were expected to.
- Getting Sick! - every teacher coming to Korea knows about this, especially those going to Seoul. So what do you do when you first get sick? It helps a lot to have someone from your workplace guide you to a doctor's office or pharmacy and explain in Korean what is wrong. Now that I think about it...both of my hagwons did well here.
The list goes on. (I've actually come back and added to it twice since first publishing this post.) I'm surprised at just how much I remember, and how many ways in which Yes Youngdo didn't measure up. Anyone reading this is probably dying to ask one question: Why didn't I quit? I'm asking myself that. I'm going to explain that soon in another writing.
If I had known about either of these two things I wouldn't have taken this job: class size and classroom size. After teaching up to 10 in each class at my former hagwon, I never, never would have accepted an offer from Yes Youngdo had I known there were 14 per class. Simply put, it's hard enough to manage ten extremely energetic kids after school in a hagwon class.The job ad at Dave's Esl Cafe which led me to apply didn't include that information at that time. Had the job advertisement mentioned this I would have kept looking. I'm absolutely sure of this.
As far as the classroom size goes, had I seen the hagwon particularly the classrooms before signing the contract I wouldn't have signed it. I would advise teachers coming to Korea to forget the free airfare and go ahead and buy their ticket so that they can check places out before working there. Were I looking for a new teaching job now in Korea I would definitely do this.
I'm adding here that the classroom was so small that I don't think it would be allowed in an institute in the US/CAN/AU or other countries English teachers come from. 14 kids plus 1 teacher = 15 people. I know that Western countries have laws regarding how large classrooms, meeting rooms and such places need to be.
Talk about claustrophobia! I could take the Seoul subway on a Saturday afternoon and not feel claustrophobic but I definitely felt it in this classroom. And I think the kids did too. Of course they don't realize the lack of space is getting to them, they just feel antsy.
I'll be checking this post again and may add more.
October 16, 2008
Finding the Job Through a Process of Elimination
Something I realized while thinking back on my difficult Yes Youndo experience was the fact that a job with them wasn't my first choice. After finishing a contract at one hagwon, I had several options. I could go to work somewhere else in Korea, return to my former hagwon or work in Taiwan. For a time I looked for jobs in Taiwan. I don't want to go into the whole story, but some things such as knowing I'd lose 20% of my income in tax and having to pay$1200 for airfare got me to go back to Korea. I was like most teachers I knew then repaying student loans. I knew if I had to pay for my airfare then I'd have to repay it with my first paycheck and then return to paying off my student loan.
As far as returning to my former hagwon, it was the number of problems there that kept me from signing a second contract. The biggest problems were long work days and not being able to trust the boss. It's good that I didn't go back because the situation became much worse. The first thing I looked for when looking for new jobs was shorter working hours. I was satisfied with what Yes Youngdo offered. Free mornings. Classes in a six hour block straight through 4-10pm. My previous hagwon had classes going from morning 'til night so this sounded like heaven.
I ruled out other options and made the decision to accept a contract with Yes Youngdo. It definitely wasn't my first choice or my idea of a perfect job. I chose it because I thought the conditions were all reasonable or as good as could be expected and it seemed logical to take that job. My biggest priorities then: pay off student loans and do some travelling in Asia.
As far as returning to my former hagwon, it was the number of problems there that kept me from signing a second contract. The biggest problems were long work days and not being able to trust the boss. It's good that I didn't go back because the situation became much worse. The first thing I looked for when looking for new jobs was shorter working hours. I was satisfied with what Yes Youngdo offered. Free mornings. Classes in a six hour block straight through 4-10pm. My previous hagwon had classes going from morning 'til night so this sounded like heaven.
I ruled out other options and made the decision to accept a contract with Yes Youngdo. It definitely wasn't my first choice or my idea of a perfect job. I chose it because I thought the conditions were all reasonable or as good as could be expected and it seemed logical to take that job. My biggest priorities then: pay off student loans and do some travelling in Asia.
October 10, 2008
Bending the Rules
During the time I worked at this hagwon, there was a period when they were short of teachers. One of the hagwons teachers happened to be in a bar one night where he ran into a teacher who was willing to teach there for a time. While we worked together, I got to know this person a little and found out they didn't have a degree, and were living in Korea on a tourist visa. Hiring a teacher living in Korea on a tourist visa was illegal.
On another occasion one teacher returned home for a while due to a family emergency. The hagwon had one of their former teachers who was working elsewhere cover for this teacher. Working at more than one job on a teaching visa was illegal, at least it was then. Neither of these fill-in teachers were of Korean descent. At that time teachers born in Korea could get a different visa which allowed employment at any number of jobs.
In addition to this, during my period of employment I worked with some young Korean-American and Korean-Canadian teachers. None of them had yet finished their degrees. There was even one, maybe two teachers who had never enrolled in college. And another had dropped out as I recall. One of them couldn't speak English fluently.
On another occasion one teacher returned home for a while due to a family emergency. The hagwon had one of their former teachers who was working elsewhere cover for this teacher. Working at more than one job on a teaching visa was illegal, at least it was then. Neither of these fill-in teachers were of Korean descent. At that time teachers born in Korea could get a different visa which allowed employment at any number of jobs.
In addition to this, during my period of employment I worked with some young Korean-American and Korean-Canadian teachers. None of them had yet finished their degrees. There was even one, maybe two teachers who had never enrolled in college. And another had dropped out as I recall. One of them couldn't speak English fluently.
October 6, 2008
Advertising for Teachers
What happens when you go to Google and do a search using the words "teaching in Korea" or go to a great blog called "The Daily Kimchi" http://thedailykimchi.blogspot.com? There will be a link for Yes Youngdo. And as it has been for years at Dave's Esl Cafe at the Korea Job Board www.eslcafe.com/jobs/korea there's the post for Yes Youngdo which is put up to recruit teachers. Lately when I'm online I see their ad all over. I can do a search for anything related to Korea and find the link the their site.
When I was working for Yes Youngdo at one weekly meeting the manager let us know that he'd gotten 50 or 100 resumes in the last 1-2 days from prospective teachers. I think this was a scare tactic, don't think he wanted to scare teachers out of their wits, but I think he wanted to put a little fear and respect into them.
With advertising like this, and considering the number of teachers in Korea, as well as guessing how many there may be who want to come, Yes Youngdo is receiving at least 1,000 resumes per week, every week of the year. At least. That's my estimate. Their advertisement and their website make them look great. Who wouldn't apply? And it's funny to think that teacher's take special care looking for a job in Korea and are more likely to choose a school with a great site, many pictures of teachers who look happy, and language such as "reputable" or "established" or "since 1987."
I've looked at their advertisements. At one point they were saying in their ad that they never paid a teacher late or had a teacher do a midnight run. Consider this:
When I was working for Yes Youngdo at one weekly meeting the manager let us know that he'd gotten 50 or 100 resumes in the last 1-2 days from prospective teachers. I think this was a scare tactic, don't think he wanted to scare teachers out of their wits, but I think he wanted to put a little fear and respect into them.
With advertising like this, and considering the number of teachers in Korea, as well as guessing how many there may be who want to come, Yes Youngdo is receiving at least 1,000 resumes per week, every week of the year. At least. That's my estimate. Their advertisement and their website make them look great. Who wouldn't apply? And it's funny to think that teacher's take special care looking for a job in Korea and are more likely to choose a school with a great site, many pictures of teachers who look happy, and language such as "reputable" or "established" or "since 1987."
I've looked at their advertisements. At one point they were saying in their ad that they never paid a teacher late or had a teacher do a midnight run. Consider this:
- They may or may not be telling the truth.
- They have enough money so can avoid paying a teacher late.
- Maybe no teacher pulled a midnight run, but how many didn't finish their contracts?
It would make sense if hagwons such as Yes Youngdo would add a bit of info to their ad or site:
- Percentage of teachers who complete their contracts.
- Percentage who would give their experience a high rating.
- Percentage who would sign a contract for a second year.
- Percentage who would allow their best friend, sister or mother to accept a one-year contract.
Another thing I also read in their job advertisements was that any teacher thinking to work there could call or email any of the teachers to ask questions. Anyone with a little experience could guess that they will take care which phone numbers or email addresses to give out! They obviously don't want a prospective teacher to talk to someone who's unhappy, feeling cheated or not a good teacher by their standards.
October 5, 2008
A Few Things I'd Say to the Owners
As I recall this institute, Yes Youngdo, was owned by a couple who only occasionally talked to the teachers. I can remember talking to each one just a few times. This was a change for me because at my previous hagwwon teachers having a serious issue to discuss would bypass the manager or other staff and go straight to the owner. I did this several times. I remember once I went to one of the owners to talk about something and they were nice but asked me to go to the manager. This reminds me that while working for Yes I was given very little, almost no explanation of how things were run, who I could go to for help and even how to teach. Unbelievable!
Here are some things I would say to the owners of Yes Youngdo if I had a chance:
Here are some things I would say to the owners of Yes Youngdo if I had a chance:
- I think you made a mistake allowing managers to have full authority to hire, train, guide and fire teachers working for you.
- If you had been more involved it would have been much better I think.
- I would have loved to be able to talk to you more, ask for advice or explain to you how I felt I was mistreated.
- I guess you eventually realized that the managers had mistreated some of the teachers after seeing all the bad posts on the ESL websites.
- The teachers who were mistreated or fired unfairly are going to remember their experiences, and the name of Yes Youngdo for the rest of their lives.
- There's also a good chance that their negative experiences at Yes Youngdo will affect the way they see Korea and Korean people.
- When they return to their countries they may influence the way others see Korea by telling their personal stories.
- Most likely some potential teachers decided not to work for Yes Youngdo after talking to teachers who had been treated unfairly or reading stories on the internet.
A Little of My Experience
It was nice to get a call from the manager at Yes Youngdo to find out I had been hired. However after that, from the time I travelled to Korea to the short period before I started working, to the start of work, the first few weeks and through the end and then after - I felt mostly these things: feeling I was in the wrong place, not feeling comfortable with the managers, (there were two) regretting my choice, wondering if I'd make it through to the end, telling myself that I'd work until the end even though I wasn't happy...the list could go on. It wasn't all hell, I had some very good classes in fact one of my favorite classes of all time was there - a grammar class which was three hours long no less. I also had some good times with the other teachers, some privates, and a few good times in the area where I lived. So it wasn't all bad! However, I'd say it was mostly bad and had it gone on for a whole year it would mean a lot more bad memories I guess.
I left Yes Youngdo after a period which wasn't very long. It was less than six months. The manager that I worked for thinks he fired me, but if he were honest he would say that I also wanted to quit. About a week before "being fired" I told him I wanted to quit. Because of this and because I told him I wasn't happy there and I didn't like the teaching program, I don't consider this a firing. (Though he may.)
Also, I want to add that due to all the bad posts I read about Yes Youngdo at some websites, I think that a lot of teachers were "fired" in some cases actually fired, some may have been goaded into quitting, some who quit may have been considered fired. One post I saw in the past had one teacher getting on and asking about a certain branch. One respondent wrote this branch had fired five teachers over the past several months. I will try to locate this post.
I left Yes Youngdo after a period which wasn't very long. It was less than six months. The manager that I worked for thinks he fired me, but if he were honest he would say that I also wanted to quit. About a week before "being fired" I told him I wanted to quit. Because of this and because I told him I wasn't happy there and I didn't like the teaching program, I don't consider this a firing. (Though he may.)
Also, I want to add that due to all the bad posts I read about Yes Youngdo at some websites, I think that a lot of teachers were "fired" in some cases actually fired, some may have been goaded into quitting, some who quit may have been considered fired. One post I saw in the past had one teacher getting on and asking about a certain branch. One respondent wrote this branch had fired five teachers over the past several months. I will try to locate this post.
September 28, 2008
One Teacher's Dismissal
There was one teacher employed at Yes Youngdo who was fired and given only a week left on their visa. This meant they had to leave the country within a week or pay a fine for overstaying. I heard from other teachers that they couldn't get a flight back to the US/Canada and settled for one to Europe. They also said that this person said they wished they had been given a little more notice. In my opinion, even if a hagwon has every reason to fire a teacher, they have to be considerate. Losing your job as an English teacher in Korea means losing your apartment and your visa. In some countries, for example China, foreign teachers can hold on to their visa after leaving a job.
Losing your job, your income, your visa, having to move out of your apartment, finding a plane ticket, saying goodbye to your friends, closing your bank account, finding someone to take things like your cell phone or cooking untensils and getting to the airport is a lot in one week!
The teacher who told me this story also thought that Yes Youngdo was unfair to this dismissed teacher.
Losing your job, your income, your visa, having to move out of your apartment, finding a plane ticket, saying goodbye to your friends, closing your bank account, finding someone to take things like your cell phone or cooking untensils and getting to the airport is a lot in one week!
The teacher who told me this story also thought that Yes Youngdo was unfair to this dismissed teacher.
September 27, 2008
Telling the Truth
In doing this, I'm not trying to upset anybody, I'm not trying to hurt this hagwon's reputation and I'm not trying to keep teachers from working there as I said before! I am someone who thinks that all people should be treated with fairness and respect. I don't believe that schools, hagwons or corporations should mistreat their employees. I don't believe anyone should mistreat anyone else. And if they do, people have the right to talk about it.
Consider this: Micheal Moore put together the very famous movie titled Sicko. I know he did this thinking that if he exposed the practice of health insurance companies making people think they're covered and then denying coverage when it's really needed, he could change things for the better. I thought the movie was great. I'm glad he made it. I'm glad it went around the world and I think everyone should see it!
Amnesty International sends letters to leaders of governments who deny their citizens basic rights. They have gotten some people out of jail who were there without reason. When a country's leader knows that people know what's going on, it can make him/her think twice about their actions.
I think all the posts on the internet about Yes Youngdo had some effect on their practices. At one time there were so many bad posts on Dave's Esl Cafe, which I think is the most popular site for teachers in Korea, that it must have worried them. The managers, directors and owners must have paid attention. This is the same site which they have used to advertise for new teachers for a long time. And their students and families could possibly see the posts. (If you haven't already please read my blog on posts being deleted at Dave's Esl Cafe http://www.eslcafe.com/.) This probably led to better treatment for teachers! Yahoo!
***Wouldn't people act differently if they knew anything they said or did could be posted on sites that have thousands of visitors?***
During the time when so many posts were on the ESL websites, these are the posts which stuck in my memory: One teacher wrote he audiotaped a conversation between him and his manager and was going to the police. (I never saw a follow-up.) Another said that some teachers wanted to catch this same manager and basically beat the delights out of him. (Not exact words.) Still another had one teacher writing that he/she was fired 6 weeks before her contract ended for asking for a few days off to go to her grandmother's funeral. She wrote that she couldn't believe it. Bonus and flight ticket home - gone! Still another teacher wrote on the number of teachers who had been fired while stating that the firings were probably timed in a certain way which allowed Yes Youngdo to save money on flights and bonuses.
(If a teacher works for the better part of a year but doesn't receive their bonus, airfare or even their last paycheck due to something called an "11 month firing" the hagwon saves an awful lot of money!!! If the monthly salary and bonus are each 2 million and the flight is at least one million, more like 1.5-2 million, that's 5-6 million won saved!! Unfortunately many hagwons in Korea when faced with this situation chose to let their teachers go.)
Unfortunately, some of these posts which tell these stories are gone. The sites have been redone. There was one great thing one unhappy teacher did. He/she took 10-15 posts, put them together and posted them all at one site. There's no need to name this site as the posts aren't there anymore. But I wish I had copied it at that time.
Consider this: Micheal Moore put together the very famous movie titled Sicko. I know he did this thinking that if he exposed the practice of health insurance companies making people think they're covered and then denying coverage when it's really needed, he could change things for the better. I thought the movie was great. I'm glad he made it. I'm glad it went around the world and I think everyone should see it!
Amnesty International sends letters to leaders of governments who deny their citizens basic rights. They have gotten some people out of jail who were there without reason. When a country's leader knows that people know what's going on, it can make him/her think twice about their actions.
I think all the posts on the internet about Yes Youngdo had some effect on their practices. At one time there were so many bad posts on Dave's Esl Cafe, which I think is the most popular site for teachers in Korea, that it must have worried them. The managers, directors and owners must have paid attention. This is the same site which they have used to advertise for new teachers for a long time. And their students and families could possibly see the posts. (If you haven't already please read my blog on posts being deleted at Dave's Esl Cafe http://www.eslcafe.com/.) This probably led to better treatment for teachers! Yahoo!
***Wouldn't people act differently if they knew anything they said or did could be posted on sites that have thousands of visitors?***
During the time when so many posts were on the ESL websites, these are the posts which stuck in my memory: One teacher wrote he audiotaped a conversation between him and his manager and was going to the police. (I never saw a follow-up.) Another said that some teachers wanted to catch this same manager and basically beat the delights out of him. (Not exact words.) Still another had one teacher writing that he/she was fired 6 weeks before her contract ended for asking for a few days off to go to her grandmother's funeral. She wrote that she couldn't believe it. Bonus and flight ticket home - gone! Still another teacher wrote on the number of teachers who had been fired while stating that the firings were probably timed in a certain way which allowed Yes Youngdo to save money on flights and bonuses.
(If a teacher works for the better part of a year but doesn't receive their bonus, airfare or even their last paycheck due to something called an "11 month firing" the hagwon saves an awful lot of money!!! If the monthly salary and bonus are each 2 million and the flight is at least one million, more like 1.5-2 million, that's 5-6 million won saved!! Unfortunately many hagwons in Korea when faced with this situation chose to let their teachers go.)
Unfortunately, some of these posts which tell these stories are gone. The sites have been redone. There was one great thing one unhappy teacher did. He/she took 10-15 posts, put them together and posted them all at one site. There's no need to name this site as the posts aren't there anymore. But I wish I had copied it at that time.
Then and Now
I know that Yes Youngdo may be a much better place to work for than it was 2, 5 or 10 years ago. (I'm not sure how long foreign teachers have been there.) I'm also aware that there may be a huge difference between branches or depending on which manager you work for.
Some of the pics posted online are much nicer than what I remember. The classroooms seem bigger and nicer. The entrance and office I saw looked better. (Of course that teacher may have been at a different branch.) I think it's great! I don't want teachers to go through what I went through.
This is a short video of a classroom. I'm not sure when this was made. I guess it's recent. I can tell you for sure it's nicer than the classroom I had! As I wrote before it had no space, desks crammed together, no center aisle and only one picture on the wall. It was hard to do much with your classroom. I never saw any decorations we could put up, nor did the managers ever talk about this. http://kr.youtube.com/watch?v=uts7SeLECIc
Some of the pics posted online are much nicer than what I remember. The classroooms seem bigger and nicer. The entrance and office I saw looked better. (Of course that teacher may have been at a different branch.) I think it's great! I don't want teachers to go through what I went through.
This is a short video of a classroom. I'm not sure when this was made. I guess it's recent. I can tell you for sure it's nicer than the classroom I had! As I wrote before it had no space, desks crammed together, no center aisle and only one picture on the wall. It was hard to do much with your classroom. I never saw any decorations we could put up, nor did the managers ever talk about this. http://kr.youtube.com/watch?v=uts7SeLECIc
If a young, new teacher can begin a contract with Yes Youngdo now and finish successfully, receive all their pay, bonus, etc. and have a wonderful time, that's great! ABSOLUTELY! That's the way it should be! It would be great if every sincere teacher who comes to Korea can have this!
Are the Stories True?
1) One can see after reading the entire posts at the various websites that some posts are dated. I think the oldest is from 2002. You may say that was a whole six years ago. Some of the current Yes Youngdo teachers were in college or even high school then and had never heard of this hagwon. However, I have to say that it really wasn't that long ago and even if it has been a few years, or up to six years, based on what the teachers say - these things really happened!
2) One may also think that some stories are made up. Well, it's possible. I'm aware of that. Some stories may also be half-true with extra tidbits added in. Each one could be completely made up. It's possible! Is it likely though that they were all made up? What do you think?
Based on my own experiences, and hearing seemingly millions of stories like these from teachers who worked all over Korea, I would conclude that the stories may not be entirely true but there is probably a lot of truth to them.
2) One may also think that some stories are made up. Well, it's possible. I'm aware of that. Some stories may also be half-true with extra tidbits added in. Each one could be completely made up. It's possible! Is it likely though that they were all made up? What do you think?
Based on my own experiences, and hearing seemingly millions of stories like these from teachers who worked all over Korea, I would conclude that the stories may not be entirely true but there is probably a lot of truth to them.
Black Lists of Hagwons
Many teachers have talked of "black lists" of hagwons in Korea. This one is pretty well done. Yes Youngdo is included here but there are so many stories that it's hard to find. http://blacklist.tokyojon.com/
This is a list of mostly institutes in Korea. Yes Youngdo is number ten on this list. Here's the link. http://groups.msn.com/teachersclub/greylistschool.msnw
I decided to copy the list of hagwons on the first page here in case this site is updated. When I first published this post, one could click on the links below to read stories teachers wrote about working for these places. It is not working at the moment. It seems the site is being updated. I will try it again later.
The stories in these links are dated. Probably many of the hagwons mentioned have closed or changed completely. But I think anyone involved in teaching in Korea should know what has gone on.
This is a list of mostly institutes in Korea. Yes Youngdo is number ten on this list. Here's the link. http://groups.msn.com/teachersclub/greylistschool.msnw
I decided to copy the list of hagwons on the first page here in case this site is updated. When I first published this post, one could click on the links below to read stories teachers wrote about working for these places. It is not working at the moment. It seems the site is being updated. I will try it again later.
The stories in these links are dated. Probably many of the hagwons mentioned have closed or changed completely. But I think anyone involved in teaching in Korea should know what has gone on.
BCM, Seoul, Gangnam
3
teacherteacher!
2007-03-16 오전 10:56
TAX in Korea - Income tax and Pension Plan
2
2CuteNCanadian
2007-03-13 오후 3:22
LCI Kids Club in Pyeongchon, Anyang City
1
BillH041
2007-01-23 오후 3:27
LCI Kids Club in Pyeonchon, Anyang City
1
2007-01-23 오후 3:24
small?
1
h896ca5vofsr
2005-03-05 오전 6:15
Englısh Fırst Istanbul Turkey
1
Ingrıd
2004-12-02 오후 11:24
BRYS Foreign Language Institute
5
1
Local Hero
2004-05-22 오전 5:12
Avoid Kid's College
4
coralee333
2003-12-30 오후 9:19
Korea Feb 2004
1
2CuteNCanadian
2003-12-05 오전 5:16
Yes Youngdo English School
3
1
James
2003-12-04 오전 3:34
Chonan English Friend
1
2CuteNCanadian
2003-12-04 오전 3:32
HELP!!! - LCI Kids Club Mokdong
1
2CuteNCanadian
2003-12-04 오전 12:10
BLACK LIST THIS CO> NOW! "SED"
1
amore-seoul
2003-09-26 오후 2:52
SLP JAMSIL SEOUL
1
MATTH
2003-09-04 오후 10:05
Cheongju City
1
JohnKorea
2003-09-04 오전 3:38
Mr. John of ECC Namyangju
1
Lemon
2003-03-21 오후 2:17
- Private English lesson in Korea -
1
2003-01-30 오전 3:26
LCI Kids Club Mok-Dong
1
2003-01-22 오후 10:38
Tomorrow's School and Kevin Lee
1
coralee333
2003-01-21 오전 5:19
Wils School-MokDong (Full list of details)
3
James
2002-12-24 오후 1:46
any info on Ansan and Swaton Language school
2
tubaman
2002-12-08 오전 2:27
YBM Sisa ECC franchise in Jeonju.
4
James
2002-11-26 오전 8:55
Some Hagwons are now literally demanding blood!!!
2
lostseoul
2002-11-26 오전 8:51
Wils Language School in Mokdong
6
lostseoul
2002-11-26 오전 8:51
OtherBlacklists
2
James
2002-11-26 오전 8:50
English Camp Uijeongbu City
2
James
2002-11-26 오전 8:49
'Oregon Language School' in Daegu
2
James
2002-11-13 오전 11:16
ECC -Dongjak Gu
4
James
2002-11-13 오전 12:04
Stay away from Oe Dae Ilsan!!!
1
James
2002-10-27 오후 6:22
ECC Dong Jak Gu (Isu Subway)
1
BigJim
2002-10-05 오후 4:32
KIDS HERALD SCHOOL: SOKCHO KANGWONDO
3
James
2002-09-08 오후 11:11
SLP School
1
James
2002-08-27 오후 10:48
Kwaks English Country School
1
James
2002-08-25 오전 12:57
July '09: Well, if you click on two links above on stories about YY you can no longer see them. When I posted this you could but now you are taken to another page and find out you can't. Go ahead and click to see that if you want.
Former Teachers' Stories
I found this post some time back and was happy to find it again. It's one of the most important that I've seen. As I recall, I found it the first time at www.eslspectrum.com but that site has since been redone and it's not there anymore. What follows is first the former teacher's post explaining the situation, then his letter to Dave at Dave's ESL Cafe and finally Dave's response.
************************************************************************************
Hi all, I'm new to this board. I used DavesESL all the time as if it was the bible of ESL sites. Last year I worked for a hogwan called Yes Youngdo English School. I won't go into all the details of the problems at this place, but suffice to say, there were MANY. I, and other teachers, have attempted over the months to convey our frustrations on Dave's site, but to no avail. It seems that the forum is not as open there as it may seem.I did manage to get a response from Dave himself, which confirmed our suspicions. So, apart from this email being a warning about the said school, it's also a hope that this forum can overtake where Dave's has halted.Please email me if you need specific details.(Email contact with Dave Sperling below)
admin, there have been several occasions recently where I and other colleagues have attempted to write about our experiences at Yes Youngdo schools. sometimes these messages appear then disappear a couple of days later, other times they just don't show up. these messages are not libel or an attempt to destroy a reputation (if that is what they already have) but a legitimate attempt to inform other potential teachers of what they may be getting into. other schools have many messages written about them far worse than what we have attempted to convey. is there a specific reason for this? quite a few people are becoming suspicious of the school's motives, especially as they have instructed teachers not to post messages about the school on your forum. a reply would be appreciated. a non-reply will obviously raise these suspicions further.
Hi Stephen,
Yes Youngdo had sent e-mail to us requesting the threads to be removed, which we have to comply on the advice of our attorney (I know it's a hassle, but I'm the one trying to keep Dave's ESL Cafe in business). Please feel free, however, to post again, including in the Job Information Journal at:
http://www.eslcafe.com/jobinfo
All the best,
Dave Sperling
Founder
Dave's ESL Cafe
http://www.eslcafe.com/
************************************************************************************
Hi all, I'm new to this board. I used DavesESL all the time as if it was the bible of ESL sites. Last year I worked for a hogwan called Yes Youngdo English School. I won't go into all the details of the problems at this place, but suffice to say, there were MANY. I, and other teachers, have attempted over the months to convey our frustrations on Dave's site, but to no avail. It seems that the forum is not as open there as it may seem.I did manage to get a response from Dave himself, which confirmed our suspicions. So, apart from this email being a warning about the said school, it's also a hope that this forum can overtake where Dave's has halted.Please email me if you need specific details.(Email contact with Dave Sperling below)
admin, there have been several occasions recently where I and other colleagues have attempted to write about our experiences at Yes Youngdo schools. sometimes these messages appear then disappear a couple of days later, other times they just don't show up. these messages are not libel or an attempt to destroy a reputation (if that is what they already have) but a legitimate attempt to inform other potential teachers of what they may be getting into. other schools have many messages written about them far worse than what we have attempted to convey. is there a specific reason for this? quite a few people are becoming suspicious of the school's motives, especially as they have instructed teachers not to post messages about the school on your forum. a reply would be appreciated. a non-reply will obviously raise these suspicions further.
Hi Stephen,
Yes Youngdo had sent e-mail to us requesting the threads to be removed, which we have to comply on the advice of our attorney (I know it's a hassle, but I'm the one trying to keep Dave's ESL Cafe in business). Please feel free, however, to post again, including in the Job Information Journal at:
http://www.eslcafe.com/jobinfo
All the best,
Dave Sperling
Founder
Dave's ESL Cafe
http://www.eslcafe.com/
Here is the link. There are also some comments from other teachers: http://koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4319
Another quick story: It is true that Yes Youngdo has told us that we are to have monthly blood tests for drugs. We have a clause in the contract which basically says we have to comply with every new rule the school dishes out during meetings. If we choose not to comply, then it's a cost effective (for YES) fireing.Also, if we say we are out at lunch, or make excuses. Again, non compliance = no job and most probably 4 hours to vacate your apartment or ----, the General Manager with get the police to kick you out.This school really thinks it owns you.
Update Nov. 13th:: Unfortunately, at the moment http://koreanesl.com/ is being updated and these posts are no longer there. I never copied the name/email addresses of the person who wrote the above comments. I'm very sorry you can no longer read the entire posts. There was an interesting story about a couple being fired and treated unfairly. I wish I had copied it here.Nov. 14th:: I did more google searches for information about Yes Youngdo and found links to posts at http://koreanesl.com and even though it's impossible to see the full posts now, one can read abbreviated versions which I'm going to go ahead and copy here.
Two full versions of posts can be read above. Just six weeks ago I posted the links and there was no trouble finding the full posts. I deleted any Korean writing and the size of each post (i.e. 16k). To find these posts go to http://www.google.com/ and type in key words such as Yes Youngdo, Korea and the site http://www.koreanesl.com/ Doing several searches using different key words, one can find several posts. I copied the posts which seem to be telling a story of mistreatment. And I put ---- in place of two managers' names which were in the posts.
Korean ESL Forum
It is true that Yes Youngdo has told us that we are to have monthly blood tests for drugs. ... Again, non compliance = no job and most probably 4 hours to vacate your apartment or ----, the General Manager with get the police to ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4429 (read full post above)
Korean ESL Forum
The general manager (I think he calls himself a director these days) is American -Korean, called ----. .... Yes Youngdo may not be the worst school in Korea, but it certainly is nowhere near the best. Good luck. Back to the List ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4356
Korean ESL Forum
First I want to say this ---- sounds like he has no business running a hogwan, if what you say is true. .... YES YOUNGDO MANAGER'S LIES EXPOSED Steve-o (Hits:731). Re:Hmm? One question (Eng/Kor) jade (Hits:779) <-- you are here ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4721
Korean ESL Forum
Although Yes Youngdo English school offers an attractive holiday of 6 weeks, it is only a little comfort for all the unpaid report writing hours and camera spying you are succumbed to. The managers ---- and ---- treat the teachers ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4421
Korean ESL Forum -
I'll refer to the post given by the manager of Yes Youngdo, and proven liar, -----(http://www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4506). He claims in his post that I was "one of those individual that take no pride in teaching and ...www.koreanesl.com/forummod.asp?ser=4538
Korean ESL Forum -
Last year I worked for a hogwan called Yes Youngdo English School. I won't go into all the details of the problems ... #####And to ----, manager of Yes Schools - why ask your head teacher at Pyongchon to instruct teachers not to ...www.koreanesl.com/forummod.asp?ser=4514
Korean ESL Forum -
... and maybe you come from a background whereby Yes Youngdo seems wonderful. but when i, or anyone else i'm close to, ... ----. ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=4526
Korean ESL Forum
DON'T work for Yes Youngdo. You won't get paid. Back to the List. ... BEWARE YES YOUNGDO youngdosurprise (Hits:201) <-- you are here ...www.koreanesl.com/forumdsp.asp?ser=20189
First Story
This is an entire post which can be found here: http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=50933 I divided it into more paragraphs to make it easier to read.
Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:28 pm Post subject:
I just finished a year contract with Youngdo. I can't speak for every branch or every teacher but my experience was pretty miserable. As far as the day to day working conditions there is nothing stand out about how aweful it is but there were a number of situations that happened at my school and others in the area that were pretty agregious.
I can give you a few examples: My boyfriend and I signed a contract with them that stated we would be placed in a 1 bedroom. When we arrived we were placed in an apartment that was a single room. There were a number of other teachers all beginning at the same time as us and there apartments were the same size, however they were single individuals. I told my manager about the situation and she absolutely refused to even make a phone call or have a conversation with me about it. My boyfriend later talked to his boss and they gave us 400.00 won a month under the condition that they were going to find us another place asap. When that didn't happen and I pressed them about it and ------ told me I was not allowed to discuss the issue with any other staff or teachers. I continued to press it and finally was given an apartment of two teachers who were leaving only because I happened to know them and specifically asked for there apartment. Since it was a relatively dumpy villa and ------ wasn't in charge anymore they gave it to us.
Another example: a couple of teacher's training at my school asked me about my apartment situation. I told them the story and they repeated it to -----. This promted his phone call mentioned above. The couple was later told that the single room they were given was in fact a one-bedroom as their contract ascribed. They argued. They lost the arguement and pulled a runner after payday.
Another example: a teacher who arrived with me arrived on a passport and visa that ran out midway through the contract. He made supervisors aware of the situation on more than one occasion. The supervisors had months to resolve the situation. They never did. When his visa ran out they told him it was his fault and his responsibility and he would pay for the visa run or loose his job. He did.
Another example: a teacher's mother was in intensive care and the doctors were saying she was not going to make it. She asked to leave and according to the contract should not have to pay back her ticket because of a family death. Well they argued that because her mother wasn't dead yet she had to pay her own way home. Her mother died less than a week later and that teacher never recieved anything from the school.
As far as the working conditions, the classes are ridiculously long and there are cameras. Neither of these things really bothered me. The legnth of the classes for some levels are really not substantiated by the ciriculum. I spent a lot of time coming up with supplementary material. However, for me 6 hours is 6 hours.
I liked the cameras in many ways because if there was ever a problem I could just say "Look at the camera and show me." This luckily never happened to me but...
What bothered me is the following: the school I worked at had serious issues with students being placed in levels far beyond their ability or being allowed to continue to move up through the levels despite the fact that they were completely failing in every aspect of the class. This is true at most hagwons from what I hear but not at all at the one I work for now. The difference being that Youngdo's expectations are extremely higher than other hagwons and at least at my old school the student's performances were far far lower than the expectations of the school. The resolution to this problem was not to build a reputation for excellence by forcing out students that don't perform but rather to keep the ciriculum the same and lower the grade scale to the following: A: 100-80 B: 79-60 C: 59-30 D: 30-0 no failure Consider that about a third of all my students were below a 50% grade.
Discipline was also a serious issue. We were told at training that for cultural reasons we were not allowed to discipline students. We were only allowed to send students out to the front desk. At the front desk the students were not disciplined even a little. In fact, after once sending a student out to be disciplined I later went out to see were he was an hour later and found him running around the hallways. When I asked if they had spoken to him they said no.
I know alot of people out there are rolling their eyes saying "that's all Hagwons," that may be true but it's not true at the one I work at now and it's not true at the ones of other teachers I have spoken to so...
Also don't expect you ten vacation days to be at all consecutive. Two here, three here, one there. You may or may not be able to travel outside of Korea depending on whether or not you want to go somewhere for four days.
Bottom line Youngdo should be a last resort for anyone thinking about signing a contract. P.S. Please don't reply to me about my spelling or grammatical errors. It's not work-related it's a website.
Note: I used ----- in place of an employee's name and I deleted info written to explain who this person is. Based on this post the employee left anyway and YY has had hundreds of employees. I don't intend to ever include anyone's name on this blog or any information which would give away their identity. It doesn't seem blogger has rules on this, but it's a matter or respect.
Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:28 pm Post subject:
I just finished a year contract with Youngdo. I can't speak for every branch or every teacher but my experience was pretty miserable. As far as the day to day working conditions there is nothing stand out about how aweful it is but there were a number of situations that happened at my school and others in the area that were pretty agregious.
I can give you a few examples: My boyfriend and I signed a contract with them that stated we would be placed in a 1 bedroom. When we arrived we were placed in an apartment that was a single room. There were a number of other teachers all beginning at the same time as us and there apartments were the same size, however they were single individuals. I told my manager about the situation and she absolutely refused to even make a phone call or have a conversation with me about it. My boyfriend later talked to his boss and they gave us 400.00 won a month under the condition that they were going to find us another place asap. When that didn't happen and I pressed them about it and ------ told me I was not allowed to discuss the issue with any other staff or teachers. I continued to press it and finally was given an apartment of two teachers who were leaving only because I happened to know them and specifically asked for there apartment. Since it was a relatively dumpy villa and ------ wasn't in charge anymore they gave it to us.
Another example: a couple of teacher's training at my school asked me about my apartment situation. I told them the story and they repeated it to -----. This promted his phone call mentioned above. The couple was later told that the single room they were given was in fact a one-bedroom as their contract ascribed. They argued. They lost the arguement and pulled a runner after payday.
Another example: a teacher who arrived with me arrived on a passport and visa that ran out midway through the contract. He made supervisors aware of the situation on more than one occasion. The supervisors had months to resolve the situation. They never did. When his visa ran out they told him it was his fault and his responsibility and he would pay for the visa run or loose his job. He did.
Another example: a teacher's mother was in intensive care and the doctors were saying she was not going to make it. She asked to leave and according to the contract should not have to pay back her ticket because of a family death. Well they argued that because her mother wasn't dead yet she had to pay her own way home. Her mother died less than a week later and that teacher never recieved anything from the school.
As far as the working conditions, the classes are ridiculously long and there are cameras. Neither of these things really bothered me. The legnth of the classes for some levels are really not substantiated by the ciriculum. I spent a lot of time coming up with supplementary material. However, for me 6 hours is 6 hours.
I liked the cameras in many ways because if there was ever a problem I could just say "Look at the camera and show me." This luckily never happened to me but...
What bothered me is the following: the school I worked at had serious issues with students being placed in levels far beyond their ability or being allowed to continue to move up through the levels despite the fact that they were completely failing in every aspect of the class. This is true at most hagwons from what I hear but not at all at the one I work for now. The difference being that Youngdo's expectations are extremely higher than other hagwons and at least at my old school the student's performances were far far lower than the expectations of the school. The resolution to this problem was not to build a reputation for excellence by forcing out students that don't perform but rather to keep the ciriculum the same and lower the grade scale to the following: A: 100-80 B: 79-60 C: 59-30 D: 30-0 no failure Consider that about a third of all my students were below a 50% grade.
Discipline was also a serious issue. We were told at training that for cultural reasons we were not allowed to discipline students. We were only allowed to send students out to the front desk. At the front desk the students were not disciplined even a little. In fact, after once sending a student out to be disciplined I later went out to see were he was an hour later and found him running around the hallways. When I asked if they had spoken to him they said no.
I know alot of people out there are rolling their eyes saying "that's all Hagwons," that may be true but it's not true at the one I work at now and it's not true at the ones of other teachers I have spoken to so...
Also don't expect you ten vacation days to be at all consecutive. Two here, three here, one there. You may or may not be able to travel outside of Korea depending on whether or not you want to go somewhere for four days.
Bottom line Youngdo should be a last resort for anyone thinking about signing a contract. P.S. Please don't reply to me about my spelling or grammatical errors. It's not work-related it's a website.
Note: I used ----- in place of an employee's name and I deleted info written to explain who this person is. Based on this post the employee left anyway and YY has had hundreds of employees. I don't intend to ever include anyone's name on this blog or any information which would give away their identity. It doesn't seem blogger has rules on this, but it's a matter or respect.
September 26, 2008
Why Am I Doing This?
I'm a former teacher of Yes Youngdo English School in South Korea. I worked for language institutes before and after being employed by this one, so I think I know a lot about this business and am qualifed to write about it.
Whether you know about Yes Youngdo, have worked there, have worked at another hagwon or are interested in learning about Korea welcome. This blog is mainly for teachers who have worked for or are interested in Yes Youngdo, but I'd like for teachers who work or worked at any other hagwon/institute in Korea to read this blog as well.
I'm going to tell some stories about my own experiences, those of teachers I worked with and post stories that I've found on ESL teachers websites. The reason is I want people to be aware of bad experiences which some teachers have had. I also plan to write about what I've learned since the time I was employed by Yes Youngdo, and talk about how it's different now looking back. I've learned so much about teaching in Korea from every perspective.
If one does a simple search online they can find out a lot about this school. Many teachers have posted photos or blogs. Some post on online forums. Some teachers said great things about Yes Youngdo while others didn't. I'm fully aware that by some accounts this is a great hagwon and some teachers had good experiences there, but I think some of the stories of bad times should be told.
I want to make this blog clear and easy to read so I'm taking care choosing colors, fonts and a template which are all easy on the easy and make the blog more readable. I also plan to edit to catch typos or other mistakes, or to add more to each post.
I'm a person who thinks everyone should treat each other kindly and fairly as much as possible. I'm sorry for all the mistreatment of teachers in Korea. I'm also sorry for hagwon owners who hire unqualified teachers.
A few things before I start:
1) I'm not trying to give Yes Youngdo a bad reputation.
2) I'm not doing this to hurt, upset or anger anyone.
3) I'm aware that teachers in Korea have had problems at many schools, institutes, colleges or universities, not only at this place.
4) Because Yes Youngdo is an institute I'm going to refer to it as a hagwon, the Korean name for institute.
5) I may abbreviate Yes Youngdo to Yes or YY.
6) When writing about other teachers I'll protect their identities as much as possible.
Peace
Whether you know about Yes Youngdo, have worked there, have worked at another hagwon or are interested in learning about Korea welcome. This blog is mainly for teachers who have worked for or are interested in Yes Youngdo, but I'd like for teachers who work or worked at any other hagwon/institute in Korea to read this blog as well.
I'm going to tell some stories about my own experiences, those of teachers I worked with and post stories that I've found on ESL teachers websites. The reason is I want people to be aware of bad experiences which some teachers have had. I also plan to write about what I've learned since the time I was employed by Yes Youngdo, and talk about how it's different now looking back. I've learned so much about teaching in Korea from every perspective.
If one does a simple search online they can find out a lot about this school. Many teachers have posted photos or blogs. Some post on online forums. Some teachers said great things about Yes Youngdo while others didn't. I'm fully aware that by some accounts this is a great hagwon and some teachers had good experiences there, but I think some of the stories of bad times should be told.
I want to make this blog clear and easy to read so I'm taking care choosing colors, fonts and a template which are all easy on the easy and make the blog more readable. I also plan to edit to catch typos or other mistakes, or to add more to each post.
I'm a person who thinks everyone should treat each other kindly and fairly as much as possible. I'm sorry for all the mistreatment of teachers in Korea. I'm also sorry for hagwon owners who hire unqualified teachers.
A few things before I start:
1) I'm not trying to give Yes Youngdo a bad reputation.
2) I'm not doing this to hurt, upset or anger anyone.
3) I'm aware that teachers in Korea have had problems at many schools, institutes, colleges or universities, not only at this place.
4) Because Yes Youngdo is an institute I'm going to refer to it as a hagwon, the Korean name for institute.
5) I may abbreviate Yes Youngdo to Yes or YY.
6) When writing about other teachers I'll protect their identities as much as possible.
I plan to write about these things: working conditions, classroom, class size, students, management, other teachers, office and teacher's room, textbooks and storybooks, homework and quizzes, perks, vacation, working hours, owners, office staff. I plan to compare everything at Yes Youngdo with other institutes I've worked for or heard about.
Please understand doing this is so important to me that I'm willing to use my free time to work on this blog. I'm not doing it on a whim - it's serious.
I welcome any comments, questions or suggestions.
Peace
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